For those of you that aren’t aware of the issue, SAR (Sarasota Association of Realtors) filed an ethics violation against Marc Rassmussen for the use of the phrase “MLS” in his domain name. Marc owned and operated a website, www.TheSarasotaMLS.com in Sarasota, Florida since 2003. Over the years he invested a numerous amount of money and time to get his website to rank in the top 10 in the search engines. Sure enough, his time and money paid off as his website captured hundreds of #1 rankings for his keywords.
Let’s fast forward to January 1st, 2008! NAR passes Article 12. In a nutshell, Article 12 gives local boards the right to prohibit their members from using “MLS” in their domain names. No where in the article did it state that the thousands of real estate agents that invested time and money building their websites that had the words “MLS” in their domain, would be excluded from the ruling. It should have contained some type of exemption for these agents!
This passage opened the door for SAR MLS Board to go after Marc’s domain name and sure enough they did. After SAR lost their ethics violation against Marc, they filed a complaint with ICANN (Internet Corporation for Assigned Names and Numbers). What I find ironic, other members of SAR that participated in rendering the decision that Marc in no way misrepresented himself as the “official Sarasota MLS”, SAR disregarded the decision of its member’s ruling and still filed a complaint with ICANN. It appears the SAR has their own agenda!!!
Unfortunately ICANN ruled against Marc and ordered that he transfer his domain TheSarasotaMLS.com to SAR! You can read the decision here. Are you kidding me! What about the years of time and money he spent building his website to get it to rank? Now all of the sudden he is required to give his valuable domain to SAR and get nothing in return? That bull#$%*!
Currently, Marc has his domain name, www.TheSarasotaMLS.com forwarded to his new site, www.luxurysarasotarealestate.com. If you want to help him keep the domain name so he can redirect it to his new site, here are a few tips that Morgan Carey with REW gave in his blog – TheSarasotaMLS.com, Gone – Help us Fight the Sarasota MLS Board – SAR, Sarasota Association of Realtors:
Send a letter / email to SAR
Send a letter / email to NAR
Send emails to your peers
Write a blog post
If this bothers you as much as it bothers me, show Marc your support and take action!
****Update*****
The Sarasota Association of Realtors has taken possession of Marc’s domain and has redirected it to their website. I think this shows what their intentions have been all aong!
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Nice post Tony! I’m amazed at the number of places this issue is being discussed. I’m sure SAR is having second thoughts on their actions/decisions of late.
That just sucks and is totally unfair. I will send letters.
Good job getting the word out. You know we are not only fighting for Marc, he is just the spearhead. We are fighting for our rights as Realtors to market how we want to for the best interest of the consumer.
We have fought this issue a long time. Our MLS settled on a grandfather clause allowing us to keep ours, but with a lot of disclaimers and rules, etc.
BTW, Major League Soccer are the real rightful owners of the MLS moniker. Good luck!
How ingenious of him to use that & how absolutely dictatorship of SAR to jump on him like that…what happened to our rights in this country? I have a friend who’s initials are MLS-do you mean to tell me she couldn’t use her initials if she so chose-that is absolutely ridiculous & they should be ashamed of themselves!
There’s an agenda here that we are not seeing-I’m sure! Someone somewhere wants something and they are grabbing that domain from him for their profit (are you sure its not someone in SAR or maybe they get kickbacks now on “his” leads)
This is really sad. What a waste of our time and money. The MLS needs to remember how they are kept alive. Here in the Fraser Valley of BC, I was asked to take down my domain (www.AbbotsfordRealtor.ca) for basically the same reason. My response, am I not an Abbotsford Realtor? So it appears we can no longer use MLS or Realtor in our domain names, two things we are a part of, pay for and keep running…
I think it’s clear that no visitors (aprox. over 700 a day?) thought they were duped and mislead into thinking they were anywhere else but a website owned and operated by Marc Rasmussen.
Until complaints can be produced by actual consumers – the Sarasota Association of REALTORS is a perfect example of an Association that needs to be reminded why Associations exist to begin with.
Making amendments to the REALTOR code of Ethics that only works against it’s members because of something “you think” but have no evidence to support your thinking is dangerous.
What’s Next?? No websites owned by individual REALTORS?
I don’t live there, and I’m no longer a Realtor, but this still makes me boil.
How can any entity decide that he has to give up something that he has owned and paid for – for years! That’s like walking into an office building that you own and telling you to move out because your MLS now wants to use it.
I can’t write to your Realtor associations, since I’m not a member, but perhaps you can add my comments to those of other non-members and let them know that they’re giving themselves a black eye all over the U.S.
Marc’s domain name should be grandfathered – since he used it long before the ruling. If they can’t do that, they need to pay him for it, just as if it were an office building he had purchased and paid for over the years. I think about $100,000 per year would be fair. In other words, about half a million. I could be wrong – maybe $200,000 a year would be better.
I am sorry but I have to disagree. If you are not the Sarasota MLS, you should not be allowed to have it in your domain name. The same rulings have been passed against those who registered websites in other peoples names, and their identity goes with the use of that name- it is infringement. Please know the law when it comes to domain names. I cannot go around saying I am the Pocono MLS and no one does, it is fraudulent.
Wow that takes guts to stab your clients like that.
Future Alternative?
http://www.NationalListingSystem.com
I agree with Jason. How would you feel if someone tried to piggy back on your success after you had done all the hard work to make it successful? How would it reflect back on you if their business practices didn’t meet your standards? Would you be willing to take that risk? Or would you take steps to protect your reputation as the MLS has?
(SAR)should be embarrassed at their own non-professional self-serving ethics violation to
purposely inflict harm on a long established business and entrepeneur.
Shame on them for a personal attack.
It needs to be grandfathered…MLS is asking for
a fight & they will most likely get one….the whole real estate business may need to change over Groups that try to maintain too much power instead of helping their Agents/Brokers.
Think it over & make the right decision,Sarasota is a great place for business,not when these type of issues cast a dark cloud on the people that are supposed to represent it with business “good will.”
Mike Walsh
Managing Partner
Commercial Real Estate Lending
Executive Funding Group,LLC
Clearwater,Fl.
I can see both sides of the issue but my sympathy is with Marc. Before embarking on to a lot of work he did his research to make sure he can secure that name and he was allowed to. Just not in writing. He’ll win and eventually get his domain back.
I am a Realtor in Westchester Co NY. I am also a webmaster & optimizer. It is unfortunate that he has to give up the name. I can see how the MLS though and some consumers might be confused when they see that name show up on google, yahoo or any other search engine. He won’t lose his traffic or hard work though. What brings in the traffic is the site not the domain, as long as they let him forward his website for at least 3 months to his new website domain, the search engines will switch from using his old name to his new one. It is how your site is laidout with keywords, tags, title in the back part of your page (HTML),,, etc…, I do agree though that they should pay him for the name he now owns. If I was to buy a name like bestbuy.com 20 years ago before the company was known, wouldn’t I have a right to be compensated for it? I would suggest and in my outlook on the whole situation that he has the right to own the name but not use it anymore since the rules have changed. I would think at least 250k would be in order and that they permit him to forward for a min of 3 months. I had a similar situation. I happen to own about 30 domains that lead to my 1 website. I bought as many names as I thought would appreciate in value. Good luck to him.
Ultimately I think Marc will win. His intent was not to be the MLS but to help people find his web site. Do we really want associations telling us how to advertise and what to do? This is a little far fetched but my initials are www. I wonder where I can go with that?
He’s wasting his time. I just went to his new site and did a search. I have to REGISTER with him before I can see anything! That’s simply not competitive. There are many, many realtor sites where I can see details without registering.
I am looking to get a new domain name and I am also running into the same problems. If it sounds like the association If it in any way could be misconstrued as something it is not, or considered deceptive, it is a no go. But I do not want to confuse the consumer, or portray myself as something I am not. Even though it is a pain to find a good domain name, I side with the MLS and NAR on this. But grandfathering in would have been nice because of the time and money spent, but we have a responsibility to ensure the public is protected against other websites popping up that will exist for no reason other than tricking consumers. If the law changes to protect the public, it may suck to lose the time and money, but it is for the good of the people we serve.
Mike is right, this is a grandfathered issue. We are members of 3 different MLS’s, and brokers in three states. What amazes me is how hard these organizations fight for an issue such as this and do not defend you when you need it. Our personal experience is some MLS are run as a dictatorship, and some could not care less what you do….
The facts as you explain them are if not completely, at least substanially incorrect
!. Article 12 is a long standing article of the Code of Ethics – what what was introduced in January 2008 was a clarification regarding the use of website that might mislead the public.
2. The findings of an Ethics hearing are confidential, however they could not find that” that Marc in no way misrepresented himself as the “official Sarasota MLS”, they could only find that his actions did constitue a violation of the Articles of the Code of Ethics that he was charged with
3. Rasmussen is suing the Association, not the other way around. ICANN found that his use of the URL was indeed misleading and prohibited his use -SO it was the oirganization that monitors and adjuicates such things that made this decision not the Association.
4. The amount of time he may have owned the name is irrelevant. If someone is doing something unethical (even unknowingly) shouldn;t they stop when the ethical issue is raised?
5. His use of such a domain name prohibits anyone else from using the name, even if they may have the same entitlement to use the name – is that not an issue as well?
The same thing happened to me in Savannah. For 3 years I had http://www.savannahgeorgiamls.com & suddenly the first of the year I was threatened with an ethics violation if I didn’t cease & desist. My argument was the same, no where in the NAR rules does it state we can’t have “MLS” in our doman name & I had a prominent link to he Savannah MLS on my front page, so I was NOT misleading the public. Yet there are sites out there, owned by non-members of NAR or any MLS who buy up these domain names & then sell space back to Realtors on these domains, that apparently is not a violation since the “owner” of the domain isn’t subject to NAR rules…..
Having to shelve the site I’d worked on so hard was the final blow to my waning business & I’ve subsequently been forced to go to referral only. I hope this fight will culminate in allowing the “MLS” term in domain names and in doing so shut down the side business of non-members selling the space to true Realtors.
I feel badly for Marc as well. Our company had the unfortunate experience of going through this process. In our case, we had been using the name bigcanoerealestate.net. The phrase “Big Canoe” is a registered trademark, and after going through a UDRP hearing, we had to transfer the name and start over.
Our feeling was that the panel handling our case really didn’t take much into consideration other than the fact that we were using trademarked words in our domain name. If I had to to do it over again, I probably would not have spent the money fighting it. Instead, I would have focused on delaying the process long enough to 301 re-direct everything to a new name.
If it’s any help to Marc, some of the documents on our case are here: http://domains.adrforum.com/domains/decisions/799382.htm
I hope Marc ends up with a resolution he is happy with.
Regards,
-Dan
This is just another way for governing bodies of real estate to make money on someone else’s hard work. The bottom line is that Marc did nothing wrong when he first got that domain name and started using it. There were no rules in place that said that was illegal at the time. Marc,
I hope everything works out for you and don’t back down.
What about all the other brokers who want to use MLS in their domain name. It only sems right.
One one hand I sympathize with Marc for all the hard work it takes to get a great website up and running. On the other, I understand where the local MLS board is upset that he is using their name in his domain. I would be mad if someone registered my name as a domain to put up info on the web that I could not control.
What isn’t fair is that other Sarasota sites still exist with mls in their domain names. This witch hunt aimed at Marc might force the Sarasota MLS to go after these other sites to cover their bias toward the #1 site. Seems like they don’t care if your “MLS” domain appears in the 2nd page of Google or farther out.
And Dan, Marc’s site got 700 site visitors a day, enough that bothered to register so that Marc had to refer a lot of them out.
It’s amazing that NAR allows a site to exist like MLS.com which IMHO does create confusion while they allow a REALTOR to be crucified by a local board. I guess it is OK to intentionally deceive the general public as long as it is done on a National scale as Home Gain does.
Marc perhaps you should ask your Local Board to drill down on MLS.com to Sarasota and explain why that is acceptable.
Mack
We had all of this happen three years ago in Minnesota. The end result is that only four companies with the word MLS in their company name or website domain name were allowed to be grandfathered in. They must disclose in all their ads online and in print that they are not the MLS, etc. It was a big mess. We also cannot us the term MLS in any of our marketing, ie. no “search the MLS” on our websites.
Having spoken to the public on their perception, many believed they were in fact searching the MLS when visitng these websites, so I cannot really sympathize with Marc. Presenting a true and clear picture to the public is very important. If you are not the MLS, then don’t give the perception that you are. Kinda like the stealth sites that agents have all over the web, getting people to provide contact information, but never informing them that the info goes to a Realtor….many people find this dishonest and so do I. These too, are violating Article 12.
Good luck with the fight!
I am getting continually frustrated with MLS organizations who do not serve the agents and brokers that make them successful. This situation with SAR is very upsetting.
This goes beyond our domains and extends to MLS selling back our leads from the properties we spend time, money, and effort to obtain, market, and sell.
Something has to change.
All the best to Marc.
- Eric Nurmi
http://www.RealtyofHawaii.com
This is a theft of Marc’s time, energy and money spent to promote a domain he purchased before the rule.
Thievery!
Those that see this as a blatant maneuver to steal his standing in Google will see that he retains it.
“MLS” is a trademarked name. I is owned, and its use controled. This Agent knew or should have known hat his use was a violation of rules he subcribes to. What about all the other members of the area MLS that pay into that system? That’s the unfair part, and it was correctly addressed by the rightfull owners there in Sarasota.
While I can sympathize with Mark for the heavy-handed approach taken by the Sarasota MLS Board, on the flip side, REALTOR and MLS are trademarks of NAR. NAR must protect its trademarks, and one requirement is that it control its use. As a member of NAR, you are given a limited license to use those trademarks.
Article 12 only clarifies the delegation of trademark enforcement to the local board.
MLSs have gotten it into their heads that they are now a marketing entity. Some agents and brokers have regained control of their boards and reversed those trends so the MLS is working for them again. In many of those cases, the agents’/brokers’/companies’ web sites become the endorsed web location rather than an MLS url.
See http://www.REindex.com for my 8 year old effort to make listing agent web sites easier to find – and do it for them for free. (Because I’m a listing broker, too.)
It the MLS is a membership organization, such as the National Association of Realtors, I can use the trademarked work Realtor(r) if I want. I have to follow the manners in which it is permitted. But if there was nothing that stated the MLS could NOT be used by its members in their advertising, and they didn’t have clear terms under which MLS would be used, and if Marc didn’t intentionally violate any rules are regs — especially if there weren’t any to begin with — at the time he registered this domain . . . then they need to leave him alone. And they are interferring with his business practice. Since when did the theory of Emminent Domain creap into domain registrations, etc. Seems totally unfair to me. The MLS is published to the general public and it’s allowed, at least in my area, and there are IDX rules, etc. I could see if he was NOT a member of the Sarasota MLS, and was using other organizations MLS info on his site, then I’d get a little annoyed. But, he’s a member at that MLS, so what’s the beef? What real estate agent or agents conspired with the MLS to make this much ado about nothing. Agents are NOT controlled by any organization in the manner in which they want to set up their advertising. If there are trademark violations, that’s one thing. MLS could be an acronym for “My Lisitng Services” and Marc could be saying SarasotaMLS for My listing services . . . I use an acornym in my domain and business name . . . have then proved MLS is NOT Major League Soccer . . .
Can we huddle together to promote the importance of HIRING a real estate agent and/or Realtor rather then spend time and energy in-fighting over non-sequitors?
Unless Sarasota has a trade mark or copy right to MLS this website could be My Lucky System (MLS). I own 3 such websites theprescottmls.com prescottmls.org This would kill me. I am emailing everyone I know.
There are tons of similar domain names all over the web! I searched for “mls .com” to find .com domain names containing “MLS” in the domain. 50 million+ results.
http://www.google.com/search?q=MLS+.COM
thesarasotamls findings vs homebylender findings.
Marc’s case:
http://domains.adrforum.com/domains/decisions/1213084.htm
My case:
http://www.adrforum.com/domains/decisions/652350.htm
This should be totally cut and dry in Marc’s favor. Did he really fool anyone into thinking he was the official MLS for the area? NO. He provided MLS search, buyer services and listing services, hence MLS in his domain name (any name) should be appropriate.
There was nothing confusing about Marc’s site. He didn’t duplicate the Sarasota MLS website design to confuse “REALTORS” into thinking that he was the official MLS for the area. Was he taking subscription fees from REALTORS that thought they were sending $ to THE OFFICIAL Sarasota MLS? NO.
Now what happened to Grandfathering? You make new rules and you expect everyone to lose money because of it!, the rules might well work for items that are created after the rule date, but to impose such rules on existing is an outright crime! Who does the Nation Association of Realtors work for anyway! We pay the dues and are the sole reason for their existance! To bite the hand of the owner is bad business! Things like this in todays market may very well hurt NAR! What they once offered is now easily reproduced on line without much effort! There will become a time, as has come for Land Line phones, when NAR will become a useless tool! I would expect that these associations have not thought about this yet, but with what I have to pay every January and believe me the cost goes up each year! it is only a matter of time when the NAR and the State and Local Associations will be of no use to me, and I will remember what they have do in the past! It will make my determination as to how I will use them in the future! So to my precious associations, National, State, and Local, start remembering who you work for, why you work for us, and what will eventually be the reason we no long wish to use you! Don’t piss off your members, we pay the bills!
Keep them at bay, help Marc win case-law. Legal fund is set up in my name link.
@Clayton MLS is the registered trademark of Major League Soccer. The Sarasota Board has nothing to do with it.
From what I understand Marc actually contacted the Florida Association of Realtors and obtained their approval prior to purchasing this domain. This is nothing more than some peers that didn’t want to invest the time, effort and capitol into developing a top ranking site.
If NAR and the local boards continue acting in this fashion they will force many to drop from the ranks. I for one can perform just as ethically with out them.
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This is a sure case of red tapism.Its hard to believe that in the 21st century and in a free-land like US,marc has to face such issues.I will make it a point to send emails & fwd this blog links to all my real estate friends.
we are with you MARC.
Since SAR and others like it are really a private entity for members only services, perhaps they should be required to pay fair market vaue for it. Sound like eminent domain?
This is such an important topic, I’m glad there has been such a great response as this is really big issue.
Someone should start their own MLS if possible.
I think what bothers most of us Internet savvy real estate agents is the theft of all of Marc’s hard earned work on his Internet links for his site theSarasotamls.com. It’s one thing to have your head in the sand and fight Marc out of jealousy over his success on Internet rankings, but entirely another when SAR steals his property and redirects his hard work on linking towards their own site. That’s Bull….
http://www.luxurysarasotarealestate.com/blog/sarasota/sarasota-association-of-realtors-says-august-2008-sees-continuation-of-summer-sales-slowdown/show/
I just wonder how the bad pub has affect thier business.
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Interesting I had read about this story when it initially had come out but had totally forgotten about it and what the outcome was. Man I can’t believe all that hard work down the drain!